Berserkers

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Postby Groogle - Czaemon » Sat Jun 25, 2005 6:36 pm

Angyish wrote:i don't buy that for a second.

i've got a 34 berserker and that guy cranks out dps like nothing else. frenzy = up to what 4 extra attacks? or was it 3? well hex hitting is pretty damn nice. as for rangers shooting and all that shit by the time we leave the EP's our rangers should be doing more dps with their melee weapons.

(i have a ranger friend who was pre EP and did more dps with jiva's sword and VZ's sword) and she had am3 eq and all that shit. i know she was doing more dps with her melee weapons becuase the mobs were dying noticeably faster and um i was having agro issues(looks around and kicks a puppie to draw attention away from the agro stuff).

as for getting said AA's we're almost fire flagged. and our zerkers are um i think brikksx put it best SLACKERS!!!!! but we should get more in here. zerkers rock.

wts serano wtb zerker's they just hack and slash serano just yells at me.

until frenzy is tied to your weapon damage, it will always be a poor man's backstab.

fully aaed berzerkers -are- nice damage, but before the aas, they are just shadowknights with fewer spells and problems tanking.
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Postby Groogle - Czaemon » Sat Jun 25, 2005 6:44 pm

becuase zerkers are the 2nd best dps in the game. those are the words of triality peeps. and i was just giving you hell serano.

also to make warrios rouges and rangers uber dps you need to AA the hell out of them.

you don't need to AA rogues or rangers to have them be better dps than berzerkers. Warriors - well, yeah, unaaed dps is pretty rank. Un-aaed berzerkers are pretty much equivelant dps wise to a unaaed warrior, or even a paladin, though.

Berzerks have a serious issue with raid utility. They can't maintank appropriate level content, random duration snare is horrible for raid kiting, and there's just not much to stun. Every other melee dps class has more utility.

Range is -always- viable dps for a ranger, it's not the best, but it's there. for berzerkers, even fully aaed at 70 with an ikkinz ranged, it's about the equivelant of a maybe 3/4 of a mage pet. That's obviouly not a killer, but having standoff capability is nice.

Pre-aa, berzerker melee damage is just awful. On my previous berzerker, with a good number of pre-oow aas, I had -no- damage advantage over an equivelantly geared tank. (ok, I did have frenzy over them - thats about 7 dps.)

there's nothing wrong with recruiting more berzerkers, but if you're wanting added usefulness at raids, require a few hundred aas
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Postby konakor » Mon Jun 27, 2005 1:07 pm

our snare is not random duration, it is 1 minute, i have timed it many times. I have my own personal reasons for choosing a berserker, but to answer Ser's question, i chose not to play a ranger or rogue because i wanted to be original. Seems like everyone and thier brother plays a ranger, making it harder to establish urself as an individual. I catch alot of grief, but its all in good fun. i checked last nite and there was 10 zerkers on between 50 and 70 during prime time hours. How many ranger and rogues? EQ cant count that high...

I have nothing against any one class, i like to mess with the other chain classes to hide my own class insecurities :) We as a class have our shortcomings, but me as a person loves to raid, and i love my class. As you can see by my raid attendance, i enjoy raiding with TF very much, and to all the chain classes out there, if u dont wanna see this gimp zerker outbidding you on gear that you could use, start saving that dkp, cause I am :razz When i bid on gear, i try to stay out of bids that would benefit our casters more than me, but my gear is pretty lame, so ill be bidding on upgrades with (/gasp) wisdom and mana on it if it is a nice enough upgrade. How cool would it be a zerker that hits the FT cap...

OK im tired of typing and rambling. See yas on the battlefield.
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Postby Serano » Mon Jun 27, 2005 3:08 pm

Heh - blood and I discused this one time - about the originality thing. And he pointed out my complete plate ensemble. So I guess I am just as guilty. Of course I traded in my plate greeves for 30 hit point more blue leather Flood pants.
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Postby Udayen » Wed Jun 29, 2005 11:43 am

I tried to find the thread from my old guilds forums but the site is no longer up. Anyways, someone took a log of all the melee there and posted the top 10 for highest dps on Atenha ra in VT. Well, we had with us a gimp (not so gimp now though but he did have his epic) 65 zerker that placed #7 on top 10, he beat out all our beastlords, monks, and rangers save 1 and came close to our higher level rogues. To say the least he was gloating for weeks. Sorry, dont remember what the number was :(.
Anyways, I enjoy the zerker to, I have one level 38 and have solod him the whole way and am seeing no sign that i need to group yet. I like his versatility, being able to pound the mobs down realy fast while tanking, and if i get an add or too low hp I simply snare and kite np. I also like it that I can fear kite with him which is usualy what i do, and if his hp is low and i need to rest, they get focused will at like lvl 8 which increases their hp regen even after the time has run out. Ive gotten Focused will up to 35 hp a tick and at 38 thats a ton so down time after fights is minimal even though i have no hp regen gear
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Postby Groogle - Czaemon » Wed Jun 29, 2005 6:15 pm

is it set now? bah.

when did it change?

or was it only every random duration and pcs? heh
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Postby Eolus » Wed Aug 24, 2005 2:18 pm

I think I may add a little to this discussion. I played a berserker for quite a while and got him from gimp to pimp, so I feel that I've got decent qualifications.

The problem with berserkers in raids is, of course, utility. Low end, we can't do crap. We're mediocre dps. I was lvl 60 when I first walked into VT and parsed under rogues, monks, rangers, SKs and warriors .. .granted I was behind on gear, but when I go back and look at parses from when I got the gear and levels to match those other guildies from the old VT days, I was still out-parsed by rogues, monks, rangers. So low end to mid-PoP gear, I was 4th in dps.

After spending some time working on a couple of offensive AAs (Ferocity, Punishing Blade, Combat Fury) I noticed a big difference in my dps. Then with 1.5, I gained a huge boost. I ended with some OoW, some DoN, and some PoP and EP gear (no Time or Qvic ... just lower end) and even two remaining pieces of VT loot. My attack was lower than rangers, rogues and monks in my guild, my hp and ac were lower (gear problem, not innate as I'll talk about in a sec) and I was behind by ~100 offensive AAs.

I parsed under two (of four) rogues and one monk. Rangers? 50-60 dps behind me constantly. The one monk who out-parsed me was up to 900AAs and had full Time/Qvic gear. Rogues? That's their job. Plus they were better geared. With that, I was still only 20-40 shy of them.

We eventually get to be good dps. With a mix of gear from Luclin on through to DoN, and 1.5 swingin away, I would average roughly 240dps on raids, 260-275 in groups. The rogues were pretty set around 300.

So DPS-wise, until we are into some better gear and levels, we're kinda pathetic. #4 easily.



But what about offtanking? Good question! Won't happen. The lore behind a berserker is basically that he's a warrior who gave up defense to pound out offense. So SoE stuck them on the same HP table as knights and gave us chain armor. So in essence, we're better tanks than rangers, but not as good as warriors, pallies or SKs. Which is how it should be. But yet again they're #4. And SoE, in its infinite wisdom, didn't give berserkers more innate damage than warriors. Oh, they DID put in innate crits after beta testers demanded it.

Why would SoE make a dps warrior class, put em on a lower hp table and armor set, but not give them higher damage output? I don't know.

But they can't tank. MAYBE the occasional trash mob if it gets down to the nitty gritty, but other than that, never. They don't have a taunt button (good IMO), but DO have abilities (snare and stun) to help them keep aggro. And those anger proc augs work in non-warrior weps too. But they'll never have more potential HP, AC or hate increase as a warrior or knight. So once again, they're #4.

That's what it comes down to. Raids? Berserkers have little utility other than dps (I mean a rogue can drag bodies and scout out areas, open some rogue-only doors AND dps; monks can pull and dps) which, at the level of progression TF is on now, is mediocre at best.

And the devs refuse to see it as a problem.
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heh

Postby bill » Wed Aug 24, 2005 2:34 pm

The devs stopped "caring" after Velious was released.

Nice write-up tho!
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Postby Eubedyen » Wed Aug 24, 2005 3:23 pm

Heh i should star playing mine again..hes 43 atm...Get him into planes and flagged..seeming Blood hasnt been around for a bit :cry
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Postby konakor » Wed Feb 22, 2006 2:41 pm

Bump...pretty sure we still suck... :?
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?!?~

Postby bill » Wed Feb 22, 2006 2:57 pm

omg who the fuck is that!?!?!
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Postby konakor » Wed Feb 22, 2006 3:09 pm

Dont be alarmed, its just me visiting. :razz
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Postby Yoshikawa » Wed Feb 22, 2006 3:44 pm

quick grab him before he gets away
On the black wind forever we ride on together
Destroying your evil with freedom our guide
When the master will storm us
He'll stand high before us
Our hearts filled with splendour
Our swords will shine over the light
___Valley Of The Damned - Dragonforce

Yoshikawa Matsumori - Lv.75 Monk
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Postby saiari » Wed Feb 22, 2006 7:29 pm

There is still only ONE zerker that can wear my pink panties, BTW my panties have been REALLY lonely....GET YOUR ASS BACK IN GAME FOOLIO!!!!!!
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Postby Ophidion » Fri Mar 03, 2006 3:26 am

MGB Warcry is like adding 473821473294 rogues to the raid for a minute.
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