Scout Archetype

If you are done with EQ or trying other games - chat about them here.

Moderator: Officers

Scout Archetype

Postby Guardrail » Wed Aug 04, 2004 12:41 pm

Some info pulled from the EQ2 forums:

Acronyms
Some rather verbose terms come up a lot while talking about scouts, so here are some acronyms that we can try to use to make typing a bit faster:

CW - Combat Wheel
HO - Heroic Opportunity
OA - Opportunistic Attacks
Function of Scouts

-Create openings in battle by causing a "combat wheel" or "heroic opportunity" to appear. More on this later.
-May be able to creat other vulnerabilities in opponents, the quotes are not decisive on whether or not the combat wheel is the only type of opening scouts will create.
-Will be able to allow the party to ambush, or sneak attack a group of opponents.

"One of the scout's primary functions is creating vulnerabilities in the opponent. These vulnerabilities allow both themselves and their groupmates to increase their damage output.

A scout my allow the party to take a foe by surprise, weaken them during the course of the fight, or set up a coup de grace that ends the battle."-Moorgard*

-Group movement buff for all scouts, called "Gift of the Pathfinder" No Selo's, sorry bards :-p
-Stealth for the entire party and themselves.
-Can "evac" or move groups out of danger when they have "bitten off more than they can chew" (Also, the July 2004 PC Gamer had a more specific evac refference than the following quote)

"Scouts are also about movement. They're the ones who can guide you through dangerous dungeons--and, perhaps more importantly, they're the ones who get you out again."-Moorgard*

-Can do "opportunistic damage", probably similar to backstab in EQLive, but requiring power.

"Doing opportunistic damage is definitely one of the key roles of the Scout."-Moorgard*

-Unlocking chests and doors.

"Only scouts can unlock chests."-Moorgard*

-Special form of considering, maybe seeing resistances, or more advanced consider tier info?

"Scouts will have an additional ability that lets them quickly survey a field of adversaries and determine the threat they pose."-Moorgard*

"In addition to level, our mobs also have a "tier" value. Two orcs could be the same level, for instance, but if the second is higher tier than the first, then the second is much harder to defeat because it has greater innate abilities.

"We are working on a way to indicate mobs that are more powerful than average (i.e. higher tier) in the UI. The idea is that you can look at a mob and judge not only its level range, but also whether it is more of a bad mutha than usual.

This tier system is one of the tools that allows us to differenciate content intended for soloers from mobs that will require a full group to take down."-Moorgard, this forum
The Archetype, Classes and Sub-Classes

All Scouts-Scouts use stealth and cunning to explore the unknown. Highly skilled at detecting and disarming traps, they are experts at infiltrating the lair of the enemy. In combat, scouts rely upon the element of surprise to inflict opportunistic damage and gain an advantage over their opponents.
Key Knowledge: Weapon knowledge, Poisons, Traps, Reconnaissance
Weapons: Axe, Sword, Flail, Hammer, Mace, Staff, Spear, Dagger and more
-Reconnaissance is likely some form of tracking, probably along the lines of avoiding mobs, not exact tracking, or our special form on considering mobs

Rogue-The rogue is a crafty cutpurse who uses trickery to gain the advantage in battle. Always shrewd combatants, rogues use every opportunity to exploit the vulnerabilities of their opponents.
Key Knowledge: Skullduggery, Weapon knowledge, Poison
Weapons: Axe, Sword, Flail, Hammer, Mace, Staff, Spear, Dagger and more
-Picks locks with lockpicks as opposed to bards, who do it with songs
"The way in which they execute these abilities will differ substantially between sub-classes (i.e. a bard's song versus a rogue's picks)."-Chris Cao, EQ-2.com interview


Brigand-Brigands are bloodthirsty highwaymen who will backstab anyone who isn't mindful of their presence. They are unpredictable wildcards who arouse fear and confusion in the hearts of their adversaries.
Key Knowledge: Banditry, Weapon knowledge, Poison
Weapons: Axe, Sword, Flail, Hammer, Mace, Staff, Spear, Dagger and more
-Freeport Only (PC Gamer, July 2004)

Swashbuckler-Swashbucklers are dashing rogues who charm their way into your confidence while secretly loosening your purse strings. Though known to brag, they are dangerously cunning and should not be underestimated.
Key Knowledge: Swashbuckling, Weapon knowledge, Poison
Weapons: Axe, Sword, Flail, Hammer, Mace, Staff, Spear, Dagger and more
-Qeynos Only (PC Gamer, July 2004)


Bard-Bards sing songs that bolster the abilities of their allies and inspire courage on the field of battle. Though skilled in a wide variety of weaponry, bards use their musical powers to wreak havoc upon the enemy.
Key Knowledge: Melodies, Chants, Weapon knowledge
Weapons: Axe, Sword, Flail, Hammer, Mace, Staff, Spear, Dagger and more
-Picks locks with songs as opposed to rogues, who do it with lockpicks
"The way in which they execute these abilities will differ substantially between sub-classes (i.e. a bard's song versus a rogue's picks)."-Chris Cao, EQ-2.com interview
-INT plays a factor in power calculation, but AGI is still key. (See Moorgard's quote in Misc. section below)
-There will be no twisting "as there was in EQ." A second quote gives a little more info. It won't be key pressing, but something else, my speculation is a bard begins playing a song, and another, and they keep on going and stay "twisted" together automatically, and the limiting factor on the number of songs going at once wouldn't be the bard's ability to button-mash, but it would be how much concentration the bard has to spare, and possibly power drain.
"Our bards are different from the EQLive variety. They still sing songs, but these will work much like a standard spell. There won't be twisting as there was in EQ."-Moorgard, this forum
"Twisting multiple songs will be possible, but it will be a direct part of the Bard play mechanic, and thus rely less on the player's stamina and tolerance for key pressing and more on resource management and tactics."-E.J. Moreland, EQ2 Stratics interview - Thanks to KrimsonNights for finding this
Songs:
Ballad of Bravery-Lyric that grants an offensive trigger to all party members. This trigger occasionally causes additional damage on a successful attack.-Use: Combat Buff
Campfire Melody-Song that decreases rest time by magically enhancing recovery rates on the entire party. However, it can only be used in non-combat situations.-Use: Utility
Startling Screech-Lyric that interrupts all actions from opponents within the area of effect.-Use: Control


Dirge-Dirges are singers of angry songs and laments, using the power of cacophony to subdue their enemies. Their songs of rage inspire the fury of battle within their allies.
Key Knowledge: Dirges, Weapon knowledge
Weapons: Axe, Sword, Flail, Hammer, Mace, Staff, Spear, Dagger and more
-Neutral (Moorgard, EQ2 Vault's Ask SOE #21)
-Receive a non-combat resurection song.
Songs:
Cry of the Deceased-Lyric that does damage to the target, and confers a portion of this damage as replenishment to the Dirge.-Use: Damage
Elegy at Death's Door-Song that restores a dead adventurer to life; however, it can only be used in non-combat situations.-Use: Cure
Chant of Mourning-Lyric that reduces Agility, Stamina, and Intelligence of all opponents within the area of effect.-Use: De-buff

Troubador-Troubadours play music that inspires strength and courage in the hearts of their companions. They lead their allies into the deepest dungeons, raising their spirits with songs of victory.
Key Knowledge: Ballads, Weapon knowledge
Weapons: Axe, Sword, Flail, Hammer, Mace, Staff, Spear, Dagger and more
-Neutral (Moorgard, EQ2 Vault's Ask SOE #21)
Songs:
Swindle Essence-Lyric that steals Power from the target, conferring a portion of this Power to the Troubadour.-Use: Damage
Subdue Essence-Lyric that prevents most spell-casting or other ability usage by the target.-Use: Control
Rime of the Elements-Lyric that reduces Heat and Cold protection on all opponents within the area of effect.-Use: De-buff


Predator-Predators are relentless hunters who use stealth and cunning to stalk their prey. At home in the shadows, predators use the element of surprise to give their allies the upper hand.
Key Knowledge: Stalking, Weapon knowledge, Traps
Weapons: Axe, Sword, Flail, Hammer, Mace, Staff, Spear, Dagger and more
-Stalking is perhaps an advanced form of Reconnaissance, closer to EQ1 tracking?


Assassin-Assassins are cruel mercenaries who hunt down their prey, showing neither mercy nor compassion. They survey dark corridors for potential prey as well as hidden dangers that may be lurking ahead.
Key Knowledge: Assassination, Weapon knowledge, Traps
Weapons: Axe, Sword, Flail, Hammer, Mace, Staff, Spear, Dagger and more
-Freeport Only (Posted by Moorgard on this forum)

Ranger-Rangers are natural outdoorsmen and trackers, masters of stealthy movement in the undergrowth. They use perception and cunning to gain the advantage over their adversaries.
Key Knowledge: Archery, Weapon knowledge, Traps
Weapons: Axe, Sword, Flail, Hammer, Mace, Staff, Spear, Dagger and more
-Qeynos Only (Moorgard, EQ2 Vault's Ask SOE #21)
-Masters of archery
-NOT spell-casters
"Rangers in EverQuest II shouldn't be thought of as the druid-based hybrid they were in EQ. Our rangers have a unique set of combat arts instead of spells. Aside from a love of nature and a fondness for the outdoors, they don't have much in common with druids.

One class distinction that EQ players will be glad to know is still around, however, is that rangers have the widest variety of high-damage ranged combat arts. In other words, our rangers will still be powerful archers who are deadly from a distance"-Moorgard, EQ2 Vault's Ask SOE #17

Combat Wheel

"All members of the party will also be able to take advantage of heroic opportunities. Represented by a segmented wheel, these opportunities arise at different points in a battle. By casting the right spell or performing the right combat art, players will be able to complete the steps of the wheel. This will culminate in some group-wide beneficial effect (e.g. group heal, group buff, added damage).
The scout archetype really shines in the presence of heroic opportunities. As the masters of special tactics, they will be able to cause the opportunities to appear. They will also be able to shift between available opportunities so that the group gets precisely the benefit that the situation demands."-Christ Cao, GameSpot Preview

"EverQuest II introduces an elaborate encounter system, combat arts, combat voice-over, and what we call heroic opportunities. Heroic opportunities play a large role in the group dynamic of combat. At certain intervals during combat, a heroic opportunity may present itself to the group. At that time, it's as if the players have spotted a weakness--almost like in chess when you have "mate in three moves." In order to capitalize on this opportunity, the group will have to perform a series of spells and combat arts. Once these requirements have been met by the group, the heroic opportunity executes. We feel that this will add a lot to combat, as a whole, and will make group play more rewarding in fun as well as in experience."-Joe Russo, GameSpot Preview

So it appears that scouts will be able to create the heroic opportunity/cause the combat wheel to appear, and pick which type of benefit the wheel will produce when completed. Without a scout, this will apparently be random, both on the effect and when the wheel appears. This screenshot has a good picture of what the wheel probably is, it's on the righthand side. (Thanks to KrikketBst for finding it!)

"Let's say a caster casts a certain spell on the group which normally effects group members a particular way, The rogue can turn the "wheel" of choice and choose how this spell will effect him/her. Does he need more strength or does he need more agility right now."-Fricka, Safehouse E3 Report

Not a full dev quote, but firsthand info from E3. This is the first I've heard of the "wheel" being used like this, and with E3 being a busy and confusing place, Fricka may have confused some details and came up with this. However if accurate, this adds a new aspect to the "wheel".

Group Roles
(See functions above for relevant quotes)

-Create openings in battle by causing a "combat wheel/heroic opportunity" to appear
-May be able to create other vulnerabilities in opponents?
-Will be able to allow the party to ambush, or sneak attack a group of opponents.
-Speed buff party
-Stealth Party
-Unlock chests and doors
-Do situational or opportunistic attacks.
-Evac party when it's in trouble.
-Special form of considering mobs.
-Back-up tank adds or when the fighter dies? (Speculation from EQ videos)
-What will a second scout in a group do?

Miscellaneous

-Ammo will be finite. Creating and acquiring ammunition as well as relative costs is unclear.

"We intend for ammunition to be a finite resource that needs to be replenished regularly. This allows us to introduce specialized ammo types for ranged weapons that give our designers a lot of flexibility to come up with some fun ideas"-Moorgard, EQ2 Vault's Ask SOE #20

-Stealth and invisibility will behave differently, and the total concealment that rogues in EQ1 have is no more.

"Stealth and Invis have the same visual effect, but they're different from the point of view of the game...the two are separate things - the game understands the diff between magical invis, and a person simply being so stealthy, they can't be seen....scouts would be more attuned to stealth, mages to invisibility"-Gallenite, EQ2 Vault Developer Chat

-AGI is the primary stat for scouts. INT also assists in power calculation for bards. No other scouts have secondary power calculation stats. Stats will matter, and some races will be poorer choices for scouts.

"Their power pool is currently based off of two statistics, but it still skews, in the case of Crusaders more heavily towards strength and in the case of the Bards, it's skewed off of their agility score. There will be some impact of other scores, but it won't be the majority of their power."-Moorgard, Online Gaming Radio, May 27

"Characters start out with lower base stats than they did in EQ. Additionally, we have an item creation plan to manage how +stat items enter the world.

In other words, base stats will have a significant impact on your character's abilities. Thus I think that the truly oddball race/class combos will be rarer than a lot of people think, though the option is there if folks want to play them."-Moorgard*

"Crusaders base their power on STR and WIS, bards base theirs on AGI and INT."-Moorgard, this forum

-Fighters do better melee DPS than scouts in a normal situation.

"But in our game, fighters do greater overall melee damage."-Moorgard*

-Dual Wield is apparently an ability for all scouts. (360 Degree Screenshot on the main site)

Questions and Speculations
Here are a few unanswered questions that were made up for the dev chat but did not get the opportunity to be asked. Please remember that the green is my personal speculation! They are by no means official answers, they are just my speculations that seem logical to me, and may not to others, and are probably not exactly or even remotely correct.

How will having two scouts in a group be beneficial? Would the second scout be able to focus most of their power into opportunistic attacks and do damage comparable to a fighter, or something else?

Speculation: It would seem that a second scout would be able to focus more power on doing his or her opportunistic attacks as opposed to the other roles of a scout that the main one will be fulfilling. Therefore it may be possible for a scout to do comparable DPS to a fighter and be desired to fill more than one group slot. Also a backup evaccer would certainly be handy.

When asked, MG somewhat sidestepped the intent of the question, intentional or not...here's what he had to say:

"Scouts definitely fall into the DPS role, as they have high-damage arts that allow them to be extremely handy in a group."-Moorgard, Ask SOE #23

How do traps work? Are they set on the ground and you lead mobs to them, or are they similar to SW:G traps and thrown at the mob? Also could you give some examples of what traps do?

Speculation: I have very little idea. Something to consider that is aside from the norm is SW:G traps, where they are thrown at a mob, and not set on the ground. Traps may just mean the ability to disarm traps, too.

Could you explain a bit on how the scout evac ability works? Does the ability work similar to EQLive and take you to a pre-designated safe spot? Or something else?

Speculation: The EQ Live version seems to be the simplest and most likely with my current understanding of the systems, but it may end up being different.

Could you explain how the three classes of scout set themselves apart from one another?

Speculation: Predators are better trackers, Bards more utility, Rogues are better at lockpicking. My best guess anyhow.
Last edited by Guardrail on Fri Aug 06, 2004 8:28 am, edited 1 time in total.
Hunter Guardrail Arcarean
Forest Stalker of Tunare
M.I.A

Pathfinder Arataurn Truebow
70 Ranger EQ2
Guardrail
 
Posts: 435
Joined: Fri Aug 08, 2003 2:32 pm

Postby deladriendil » Thu Aug 05, 2004 2:21 am

Group: Scout
Primary Attribute: Agility
Key Knowledges: Weapon Knowledges, Poison, Traps, Reconnaissance
Weapons: Axe, Sword, Flail, Hammer, Mace, Staff, Spear, Dagger & More
Armor: Light
Sub Class of: N/A

Sub Class: Rogue
Primary Attribute: Agility
Key Knowledges: Skullduggery, Weapon Knowledges, Poison
Weapons: Axe, Sword, Flail, Hammer, Mace, Staff, Spear, Dagger & More
Armor: Medium
Sub Class of: Scout

Final Class: Brigand
Primary Attribute: Agility
Key Knowledges: Banditry, Weapon Knowledges, Poison
Weapons: Axe, Sword, Flail, Hammer, Mace, Staff, Spear, Dagger & More
Armor: Medium
Sub Class of: Rogue

Final Class: Swashbuckler
Primary Attribute: Agility
Key Knowledges: Swashbuckling, Weapon Knowledges, Poison
Weapons: Axe, Sword, Flail, Hammer, Mace, Staff, Spear, Dagger & More
Armor: Medium
Sub Class of: Rogue

Sub Class: Bard
Primary Attribute: Agility
Key Knowledges: Melodies, Chants, Weapon Knowledges
Weapons: Axe, Sword, Flail, Hammer, Mace, Staff, Spear, Dagger & More
Armor: Medium
Sub Class of: Scout

Final Class: Dirge
Primary Attribute: Agility
Key Knowledges: Dirges, Weapon Knowledges
Weapons: Axe, Sword, Flail, Hammer, Mace, Staff, Spear, Dagger & More
Armor: Medium
Sub Class of: Bard

Final Class: Troubadour
Primary Attribute: Agility
Key Knowledges: Ballads, Weapon Knowledges
Weapons: Axe, Sword, Flail, Hammer, Mace, Staff, Spear, Dagger & More
Armor: Medium
Sub Class of: Bard

Sub Class: Predator
Primary Attribute: Agility
Key Knowledges: Stalking, Weapon Knowledges, Traps
Weapons: Axe, Sword, Flail, Hammer, Mace, Staff, Spear, Dagger & More
Armor: Medium
Sub Class of: Scout

Final Class: Assassin
Primary Attribute: Agility
Key Knowledges: Assassination, Weapon Knowledges, Traps
Weapons: Axe, Sword, Flail, Hammer, Mace, Staff, Spear, Dagger & More
Armor: Medium
Sub Class of: Predator

Final Class: Ranger
Primary Attribute: Agility
Key Knowledges: Archery, Weapon Knowledges, Traps
Weapons: Axe, Sword, Flail, Hammer, Mace, Staff, Spear, Dagger & More
Armor: Medium
Sub Class of: Predator

Advancement
Level 0-2: No Class
Level 3: Pick Group (Scout)
Level 10: Pick Sub-Class (Bard)
Level 20: Pick Final Class (Troubadour)
Level 50: Level Cap at Launch
deladriendil
Lurker
 
Posts: 435
Joined: Thu Aug 07, 2003 9:20 am
Location: Pittsburgh, PA


Return to EQ2 and Other games

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest

cron